On 04/09/2025 23:45, Oliver Hunt wrote:
>
>
>> On Sep 4, 2025, at 1:59 PM, David Brown <david.brown_at_[hidden]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> On 04/09/2025 15:33, Marcin Jaczewski wrote:
>>> czw., 4 wrz 2025 o 14:51 David Brown <david.brown_at_[hidden]
>>> <mailto:david.brown_at_[hidden]>> napisał(a):
>>> My point was that you could manually detect overflow if its not UB and
>>> react accordingly.
>>> UB sometimes makes it very hard to do some naive checks as they are
>>> UB itself
>>> and can be removed by the compiler. And this is probably the biggest
>>> gripe that
>>> people have with UB.
>>
>> That's just nonsense. Seriously - there is no need to have wrapping
>> integer overflow in order to detect problems.
>
> I am getting tired of this.
>
> Your replies on this list are needlessly disrespectful.

I am very sorry if they appeared that way. I do not intend to be
disrespectful, but I am frustrated by repeated incorrect claims. I have
no problem with different opinions - if someone /prefers/ a particular
overflow behaviour, that is their preference. However, if someone makes
factual claims about it being "better" in some way, when it can be shown
that it is not, then they are wrong. People get things wrong all the
time - from misunderstandings, ignorance, habit, or other reasons. I
certainly do, and I appreciate when I am corrected or given better
information.

In this discussion, I think there has been a certain amount of mixup
between factual matters, and opinions. There has also been a high
degree of failure (on many sides) to address points that posters have
brought up. This has led to a significant repetition of arguments, and
I do not believe I am the only person frustrated. But perhaps more than
others, I have let myself get worked up about it and written in an
overly heated an emotional way - as I feel my points have not been
understood, I have tended to exaggerate them as I restated them. (If
you look at some of my calmer posts, I have made it clear that I support
people being able to pick many different overflow behaviours when that
is what they want in their code.)

I have read the rest of your post, but I am specifically not replying to
it - I am taking the advice of your last paragraph. I /have/ behaved
badly, unintentionally, and I am sorry if anyone felt insulted, and for
the time wasted.

David


> Treating other committee members as if their opinion is inherently
> wrong, or unreasonable, simply because it does not align with your
> viewpoint is uncalled for.
>
> If you are finding this thread stressful, or frustrating, or whatever -
> it happens - just take a break, cool off, and come back to it then.
>
> —Oliver
>