Hi all, for tomorrow's SG14 meeting, we can discuss Patrice game paper, or
specifically any news on P3442 [[invalidate_dereferencing]] which was
approved by SG23 in Hagenberg and heading to EWG.
Are there any other papers of interest? Thanks.

Michael Wong is inviting you to a scheduled Zoom meeting.

Topic: SG14 monthly
Time: 2nd Wednesdays 02:00 PM Eastern Time (US and Canada)
    Every month on the Second Wed,

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Agenda:

1. Opening and introduction

ISO Code of Conduct
<
https://isotc.iso.org/livelink/livelink?func=ll&objId=20882226&objAction=Open&nexturl=%2Flivelink%2Flivelink%3Ffunc%3Dll%26objId%3D20158641%26objAction%3Dbrowse%26viewType%3D1
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ISO patent policy.
https://isotc.iso.org/livelink/livelink/fetch/2000/2122/3770791/Common_Policy.htm?nodeid=6344764&vernum=-2

IEC Code of Conduct:

https://www.iec.ch/basecamp/iec-code-conduct-technical-work

WG21 Code of Conduct:

https://isocpp.org/std/standing-documents/sd-4-wg21-practices-and-procedures

1.1 Roll call of participants

1.2 Adopt agenda

1.3 Approve minutes from the previous meeting, and approve publishing
 previously approved minutes to ISOCPP.org

1.4 Action items from previous meetings

2. Main issues (125 min)

2.1 General logistics

2024 planning
C++23 and C++26 status
CPPCON SG14/19

Future and past meeting plans

* Jan 8, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Cancelled
* Feb 12, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Hagenberg F2F; Cancelled
* Mar 12, 2025 02:00 PM ET: DST cancelled
* Apr 9, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Finance
* May 7, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Games
* June 11, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Sofia F2F
* July 9, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Embedded
* Aug 13, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Finance
* Sep 10, 2025 02:00 PM ET: CPPCON 9/14
* Oct 8, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Games
* Nov 12, 2025 02:00 PM ET: F2F
* Dec 10, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Embedded


2.2 Paper reviews
Embedded:
* P3132 Accept attributes with user-defined prefixes
* P3134 Attribute [[asserts_rvo]]
Deterministic Exception for Embedded by James Renwick
https://www.pure.ed.ac.uk/ws/portalfiles/portal/78829292/low_cost_deterministic_C_exceptions_for_embedded_systems.pdf

Freestanding Updates

Games paper review

Arthur's suggestions:
(1) I put in the Slack channel
<https://cpplang.slack.com/archives/C3TK2M6HH/p1703947057425609> a while
ago Clang PR #76596 <https://github.com/llvm/llvm-project/pull/76596>, from
one Max Winkler, apparently in game dev. I don't think the PR stands much
chance of getting merged into Clang; but it might still be of interest to
SG14 folks. The issue description is very long and somewhat detailed, and
then there's more discussion/debate in the comments
<https://github.com/llvm/llvm-project/pull/76596#issuecomment-1872601156>.
(I'd actually be interested in talking to Max, but he doesn't publish his
email address on GitHub and I guess that might be on purpose.)

(2) LEWG will be seeing my P3055 "Relax wording to permit relocation
optimizations in the STL"
<https://quuxplusone.github.io/draft/d3055-relocation.html> in a telecon on
February 20th. (Related blog post.
<https://quuxplusone.github.io/blog/2024/01/02/bsl-vector-erase/>) Might
be interesting to folks who do EASTL-style containers. I'd be interested in
early feedback and/or telecon attendance.


Discussion on Embedded:
Paul's suggestions
The next meeting would then be Embedded and I would be interested in
knowing if people think a module std.freestanding is worth pursuing.
In that context I'd like to get some feedback perhaps already for the
upcoming meeting, if people have started using modules, and if so if it has
brought the promised expectations or if you are holding back if you see any
relevance in modules.

Review latest mailings:
P2532 Removing exception_ptr from the receivers concept
Based on the last meeting and the discussions here.
P2544 C++ Exceptions are becoming more and more problematic
We might want to chime in here.
/Paul
P. S. P2327 de-deprecating volatile received a "consensus" straw poll.


Discussion on Low Latency/Finance topics

http://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/docs/papers/2022/p1839r4.pdf





Discussion about Games topics:

 P2388R1 - Minimum Contract Support: either Ignore or Check_and_abort
<http://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/docs/papers/2021/p2388r1.html>





2.2.1 any other proposal for reviews?



SG14/SG19 features/issues/defects:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JnUJBO72QVURttkKr7gn0_WjP--P0vAne8JBfzbRiy0/edit#gid=0

2.3 Domain-specific discussions

2.3.1 SIG chairs

   - Embedded Programming chairs: Ben Craig, Wouter van Ooijen and Odin
 Holmes, John McFarlane

   - Financial/Trading chairs: Robin Rowe, Staffan TjernstrÃm
Carl Cooke, Neal Horlock,
   - Games chairs: Rene Riviera, Guy Davidson and Paul Hampson, Patrice Roy

   - Linear Algebra chairs: Bob Steagall, Mark Hoemmen, Guy Davidson

2.4 Other Papers and proposals

2.5 Future F2F meetings:

2.6 future C++ Standard meetings:
https://isocpp.org/std/meetings-and-participation/upcoming-meetings

-

3. Any other business
Reflector
https://lists.isocpp.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/sg14
As well as look through papers marked "SG14" in recent standards committee
paper mailings:
http://open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/docs/papers/2015/
http://open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/docs/papers/2016/

Code and proposal Staging area
https://github.com/WG21-SG14/SG14
4. Review

4.1 Review and approve resolutions and issues [e.g., changes to SG's
working draft]

4.2 Review action items (5 min)

5. Closing process

5.1 Establish next agenda

5.2 Future meeting


Future and past meeting plans

* Jan 8, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Cancelled
* Feb 12, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Hagenberg F2F; Cancelled
* Mar 12, 2025 02:00 PM ET: DST cancelled
* Apr 9, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Finance
* May 7, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Games
* June 11, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Sofia F2F
* July 9, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Embedded
* Aug 13, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Finance
* Sep 10, 2025 02:00 PM ET: CPPCON 9/14
* Oct 8, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Games
* Nov 12, 2025 02:00 PM ET: F2F
* Dec 10, 2025 02:00 PM ET: Embedded