Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2021 15:16:13 -0400
Meeting notes.
On Tue, Apr 13, 2021 at 10:53 AM Michael Wong <fraggamuffin_at_[hidden]>
wrote:
> Topic: SG14 Low Latency Monthly
>
> This meeting is focused on Finance/Low latency.
>
> Hi,
>
> Michael Wong is inviting you to a scheduled Zoom meeting.
>
> Topic: SG14 monthly
> Time: 2nd Wednesdays 02:00 PM Eastern Time 1800 UTC (US and Canada)
> Every month on the Second Wed,
> Apr 14, 2020 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
> May 12, 2021 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
> June 9, 2021 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
>
>
> Join from PC, Mac, Linux, iOS or Android:
> https://iso.zoom.us/j/93151864365?pwd=aDhOcDNWd2NWdTJuT1loeXpKbTcydz09
> Password: 789626
>
> Or iPhone one-tap :
> US: +12532158782,,93151864365# or +13017158592,,93151864365#
> Or Telephone:
> Dial(for higher quality, dial a number based on your current location):
> US: +1 253 215 8782 or +1 301 715 8592 or +1 312 626 6799 or +1
> 346 248 7799 or +1 408 638 0968 or +1 646 876 9923 or +1 669 900 6833
> or 877 853 5247 (Toll Free)
> Meeting ID: 931 5186 4365
> Password: 789626
> International numbers available: https://iso.zoom.us/u/abRrVivZoD
>
> Or Skype for Business (Lync):
> https://iso.zoom.us/skype/93151864365
>
> Agenda:
>
> 1. Opening and introduction
>
> ISO Code of Conduct
> <
>
> https://isotc.iso.org/livelink/livelink?func=ll&objId=20882226&objAction=Open&nexturl=%2Flivelink%2Flivelink%3Ffunc%3Dll%26objId%3D20158641%26objAction%3Dbrowse%26viewType%3D1
> >
>
> ISO patent policy.
>
> https://isotc.iso.org/livelink/livelink/fetch/2000/2122/3770791/Common_Policy.htm?nodeid=6344764&vernum=-2
>
> WG21 Code of COnduct:
>
>
> https://isocpp.org/std/standing-documents/sd-4-wg21-practices-and-procedures
>
> 1.1 Roll call of participants
>
Andreas Weis, Ben Saks, Billy Baker, Conor Horman, Henry Miller, Jakob
Lovhall, Michael Adams, Piotr Grygorczuk, Puya Daravi, Rene Ferdinand
Rivera Morell, Ronan Keryell, Sean Middleditch, Sophia Porier, Jeffrey
Olkin, Matthew Butler, Michael Wong, Jens Maurer , Guy Davidson, Max
Gardner, John McFarlane
> 1.2 Adopt agenda
>
> 1.3 Approve minutes from previous meeting, and approve publishing
> previously approved minutes to ISOCPP.org
>
> 1.4 Action items from previous meetings
>
> 2. Main issues (125 min)
>
> 2.1 General logistics
>
> Future meeting plans
>
> Apr 14, 2020 02:00 PM ET/1800 UTC: Finance focus on low latency
>
> May 12, 2021 02:00 PM ET/1800UTC: Games
> June 9, 2021 02:00 PM ET/1800 UTC: Embedded
>
> 2.2 Paper reviews
>
> Compound assignment review
>
thank Wouter and SG14 in acknowledgment
intro should say embedded community (who never update their 3rd party
header) that was overlooked in initial review which focused on SG1
so a different interface will not fix the problem for future
some compatibility layer from vendors for future? that is a future proposal
make sure += does not appear from header analysis
mixed C and C++ impact: add SG22 lukewam reception
also porting of C to C++ impact
restore status quo in existence for 30 years
[depr.volatile.type] annex might need to be updated
de-deprecate is split in 3.2 make it a newline
> Low Latency topic brainstorm
>
fpga offload computation suing VHDL/verilog
nanosecond resolution, lock free programming
low latency, control of generated assembly
can I access hardware features, memory card,
C like subset of C++ for this,
memory barriers
no support for I/O control, DMA memory, whether device is there, but these
may be out of scope
what does low latency mean? is it an upper bound? is it determinism?
also need thread priorities Patrice roy
also need cache controlling
also needing scheduling periodic thread intervals, by some deadline
(flagging a real-time thread, deal with conflicts)
get a processor onto a cpu when its idle
we also need cpu pinning, like madvise
also mange memory mapped files carefully,
but most of these are owned by the OS
standardize filesystem, but many freestanding systems that don't have this,
offer standard cross platform apis for this, is there standard policy for
this
support some real time thread with a deadline, allows you to associate
n-number of threads as working on same real time constraint, grouping api
should we add threading attribute that support this
Vulkan has a capability model, standard model, but capability fits specific
hardware
standard api to query capability
use encoding like unicode api
what about Os vs bare metal / library only profiles
conditionally support is a kind of segmentation already
concern about SQL profiles which seem to fail
features with non-local
vft, I asked for it so thats ok
embedded small devices stuck with C89,
similar for templates which don't generate object code
we have compilers that have flags to subset; this leaves people out in the
cold and segmented language, hwo to help a single C++ instead of subset
dialects
floating point hardware is not needed for floating point, avoid use at
runtime with a lookup table
annotate and enforce real-time constraint on a call path to say a function
needs real-time, or trap at runtime if unable to satisfy; say threads is
allowed or not allowed to call synchronous apis but aim to fail early
Freestanding?
>
> 2.2.1 any other proposal for reviews?
>
> SG14/SG19 features/issues/defects:
>
>
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JnUJBO72QVURttkKr7gn0_WjP--P0vAne8JBfzbRiy0/edit#gid=0
>
> 2.3 Domain-specific discussions
>
> 2.3.1 SIG chairs
>
> - Embedded Programming chairs: Ben Craig, Wouter van Ooijen and Odin
> Holmes, John McFarlane
>
> - Financial/Trading chairs: Staffan Tjernström, Carl Cooke, Neal
> Horlock,
> Mateusz Pusz, Clay Trychta,
> - Games chairs: Rene Riviera, Guy Davidson and Paul Hampson
> - Linear Algebra chairs: Bob Steagall, Mark Hoemmen, Guy Davidson
>
> 2.4 Other Papers and proposals
>
> 2.5 Future F2F meetings:
>
> 2.6 future C++ Standard meetings:
> https://isocpp.org/std/meetings-and-participation/upcoming-meetings
>
> -
>
> 3. Any other business
> Reflector
> https://lists.isocpp.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/sg14
> As well as look through papers marked "SG14" in recent standards committee
> paper mailings:
> http://open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/docs/papers/2015/
> http://open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/docs/papers/2016/
>
> Code and proposal Staging area
> https://github.com/WG21-SG14/SG14
> 4. Review
>
> 4.1 Review and approve resolutions and issues [e.g., changes to SG's
> working draft]
>
> 4.2 Review action items (5 min)
>
> 5. Closing process
>
> 5.1 Establish next agenda
>
> 5.2 Future meeting
>
> Apr 14, 2020 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
> May 12, 2021 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
> June 9, 2021 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
>
>
> Kind Rgds
>
On Tue, Apr 13, 2021 at 10:53 AM Michael Wong <fraggamuffin_at_[hidden]>
wrote:
> Topic: SG14 Low Latency Monthly
>
> This meeting is focused on Finance/Low latency.
>
> Hi,
>
> Michael Wong is inviting you to a scheduled Zoom meeting.
>
> Topic: SG14 monthly
> Time: 2nd Wednesdays 02:00 PM Eastern Time 1800 UTC (US and Canada)
> Every month on the Second Wed,
> Apr 14, 2020 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
> May 12, 2021 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
> June 9, 2021 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
>
>
> Join from PC, Mac, Linux, iOS or Android:
> https://iso.zoom.us/j/93151864365?pwd=aDhOcDNWd2NWdTJuT1loeXpKbTcydz09
> Password: 789626
>
> Or iPhone one-tap :
> US: +12532158782,,93151864365# or +13017158592,,93151864365#
> Or Telephone:
> Dial(for higher quality, dial a number based on your current location):
> US: +1 253 215 8782 or +1 301 715 8592 or +1 312 626 6799 or +1
> 346 248 7799 or +1 408 638 0968 or +1 646 876 9923 or +1 669 900 6833
> or 877 853 5247 (Toll Free)
> Meeting ID: 931 5186 4365
> Password: 789626
> International numbers available: https://iso.zoom.us/u/abRrVivZoD
>
> Or Skype for Business (Lync):
> https://iso.zoom.us/skype/93151864365
>
> Agenda:
>
> 1. Opening and introduction
>
> ISO Code of Conduct
> <
>
> https://isotc.iso.org/livelink/livelink?func=ll&objId=20882226&objAction=Open&nexturl=%2Flivelink%2Flivelink%3Ffunc%3Dll%26objId%3D20158641%26objAction%3Dbrowse%26viewType%3D1
> >
>
> ISO patent policy.
>
> https://isotc.iso.org/livelink/livelink/fetch/2000/2122/3770791/Common_Policy.htm?nodeid=6344764&vernum=-2
>
> WG21 Code of COnduct:
>
>
> https://isocpp.org/std/standing-documents/sd-4-wg21-practices-and-procedures
>
> 1.1 Roll call of participants
>
Andreas Weis, Ben Saks, Billy Baker, Conor Horman, Henry Miller, Jakob
Lovhall, Michael Adams, Piotr Grygorczuk, Puya Daravi, Rene Ferdinand
Rivera Morell, Ronan Keryell, Sean Middleditch, Sophia Porier, Jeffrey
Olkin, Matthew Butler, Michael Wong, Jens Maurer , Guy Davidson, Max
Gardner, John McFarlane
> 1.2 Adopt agenda
>
> 1.3 Approve minutes from previous meeting, and approve publishing
> previously approved minutes to ISOCPP.org
>
> 1.4 Action items from previous meetings
>
> 2. Main issues (125 min)
>
> 2.1 General logistics
>
> Future meeting plans
>
> Apr 14, 2020 02:00 PM ET/1800 UTC: Finance focus on low latency
>
> May 12, 2021 02:00 PM ET/1800UTC: Games
> June 9, 2021 02:00 PM ET/1800 UTC: Embedded
>
> 2.2 Paper reviews
>
> Compound assignment review
>
thank Wouter and SG14 in acknowledgment
intro should say embedded community (who never update their 3rd party
header) that was overlooked in initial review which focused on SG1
so a different interface will not fix the problem for future
some compatibility layer from vendors for future? that is a future proposal
make sure += does not appear from header analysis
mixed C and C++ impact: add SG22 lukewam reception
also porting of C to C++ impact
restore status quo in existence for 30 years
[depr.volatile.type] annex might need to be updated
de-deprecate is split in 3.2 make it a newline
> Low Latency topic brainstorm
>
fpga offload computation suing VHDL/verilog
nanosecond resolution, lock free programming
low latency, control of generated assembly
can I access hardware features, memory card,
C like subset of C++ for this,
memory barriers
no support for I/O control, DMA memory, whether device is there, but these
may be out of scope
what does low latency mean? is it an upper bound? is it determinism?
also need thread priorities Patrice roy
also need cache controlling
also needing scheduling periodic thread intervals, by some deadline
(flagging a real-time thread, deal with conflicts)
get a processor onto a cpu when its idle
we also need cpu pinning, like madvise
also mange memory mapped files carefully,
but most of these are owned by the OS
standardize filesystem, but many freestanding systems that don't have this,
offer standard cross platform apis for this, is there standard policy for
this
support some real time thread with a deadline, allows you to associate
n-number of threads as working on same real time constraint, grouping api
should we add threading attribute that support this
Vulkan has a capability model, standard model, but capability fits specific
hardware
standard api to query capability
use encoding like unicode api
what about Os vs bare metal / library only profiles
conditionally support is a kind of segmentation already
concern about SQL profiles which seem to fail
features with non-local
vft, I asked for it so thats ok
embedded small devices stuck with C89,
similar for templates which don't generate object code
we have compilers that have flags to subset; this leaves people out in the
cold and segmented language, hwo to help a single C++ instead of subset
dialects
floating point hardware is not needed for floating point, avoid use at
runtime with a lookup table
annotate and enforce real-time constraint on a call path to say a function
needs real-time, or trap at runtime if unable to satisfy; say threads is
allowed or not allowed to call synchronous apis but aim to fail early
Freestanding?
>
> 2.2.1 any other proposal for reviews?
>
> SG14/SG19 features/issues/defects:
>
>
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JnUJBO72QVURttkKr7gn0_WjP--P0vAne8JBfzbRiy0/edit#gid=0
>
> 2.3 Domain-specific discussions
>
> 2.3.1 SIG chairs
>
> - Embedded Programming chairs: Ben Craig, Wouter van Ooijen and Odin
> Holmes, John McFarlane
>
> - Financial/Trading chairs: Staffan Tjernström, Carl Cooke, Neal
> Horlock,
> Mateusz Pusz, Clay Trychta,
> - Games chairs: Rene Riviera, Guy Davidson and Paul Hampson
> - Linear Algebra chairs: Bob Steagall, Mark Hoemmen, Guy Davidson
>
> 2.4 Other Papers and proposals
>
> 2.5 Future F2F meetings:
>
> 2.6 future C++ Standard meetings:
> https://isocpp.org/std/meetings-and-participation/upcoming-meetings
>
> -
>
> 3. Any other business
> Reflector
> https://lists.isocpp.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/sg14
> As well as look through papers marked "SG14" in recent standards committee
> paper mailings:
> http://open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/docs/papers/2015/
> http://open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/docs/papers/2016/
>
> Code and proposal Staging area
> https://github.com/WG21-SG14/SG14
> 4. Review
>
> 4.1 Review and approve resolutions and issues [e.g., changes to SG's
> working draft]
>
> 4.2 Review action items (5 min)
>
> 5. Closing process
>
> 5.1 Establish next agenda
>
> 5.2 Future meeting
>
> Apr 14, 2020 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
> May 12, 2021 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
> June 9, 2021 02:00 PM 1800 UTC
>
>
> Kind Rgds
>
Received on 2021-04-14 14:16:29